I was just reading up a bit on quicker strides and faster turnover to help you run faster and more efficiently. My cousin was saying his coach told him to shorten up his stride also. Has anyone tried this, and has it worked?
I am a barefoot/minimalist runner and I have found that in general a quicker turnover, around 180 steps/min or 3 steps/sec, is great for a number of things. First while it can take a while to get used to it and adjust, it does make you more efficient and better able to adjust to changes in the course and pace, it also allows you to cruise down hills (which in my experience is a useful tactic in xc races). If you want an explanation as to why it is more efficient to have a faster turnover it deals with the "re-acceleration" of the body that the legs have provide, in regards to time, the shorter the interval of re-acceleration -> the less the force is required during the re-acceleration (i.e. stride). In general it will help increase your reaction time, stride efficiency, help reduce injury (also heavily influenced by foot-fall-position: form stuff), and will help you become a better and faster runner. Final note/criticism: don't "shorten" your stride to the point where your steps are choppy.
So yes this has worked very well for me, and it is pretty much a "necessity" for barefoot/minimalist running. I hope that this helped answer your questions. Here is a link to a video I made a while ago which might be helpful for visualizing quicker, but not shorter strides: http://youtu.be/vZi9S9M99iI
I was just reading up a bit on quicker strides and faster turnover to help you run faster and more efficiently. My cousin was saying his coach told him to shorten up his stride also. Has anyone tried this, and has it worked?
Aside from the very good post above, I wouldn't shorten your stride unless you overstride and heel strike. If you want to quicken your stride try increasing your arm swing tempo. Everything your arms do your legs will do.
p.s. Based on your photo, you don't heel strike but you do cross your arms over too much.
Brewpat: based on your photo it looks like you cross you arm over chest too much. Also you seem to run while sitting and holding a sign. That can't be good for your footstrike.
I was just reading up a bit on quicker strides and faster turnover to help you run faster and more efficiently. My cousin was saying his coach told him to shorten up his stride also. Has anyone tried this, and has it worked?
ddarkstar has a good point. Here's a video which might help. It might not, I don't know.
But, there are some other decent videos on youtube which break down 'proper' running via barefoot/minimal running.
Thanks for the info, I fiddled with it a little in practice today when we were doing striders. I tweaked my legs to turn over just a bit quicker and the speed came pretty easily. Hopefully I'm on to something here
And brewpat, I don't heel strike, as you said (I changed that as well, I used to heel strike very badly) but I do overstride. I've done a stride analysis on myself and my foot comes way out in front of me when I land. I did another with the shorter stride i've been trying and it definitely looks better; my foot lands almost directly underneath me
And brewpat, I don't heel strike, as you said (I changed that as well, I used to heel strike very badly) but I do overstride. I've done a stride analysis on myself and my foot comes way out in front of me when I land. I did another with the shorter stride i've been trying and it definitely looks better; my foot lands almost directly underneath me
One might argue if you overstride, you heel strike. In any event, if you shorten up your arm swing you'll shorten up your stride. Lead with the knee, not the foot.
p.s. Based on your photo, you don't heel strike but you do cross your arms over too much.
You've got to be kidding me. There's absolutely no way you can tell whether or not he heel strikes based on that photo. You and Ayedubbs both think you're experts on judging people's form based on profile pictures, but (1) you don't know what's about to happen in the split second after the frame, and (2) you don't know what happened in the split second before the frame.
p.s. Based on your photo, you don't heel strike but you do cross your arms over too much.
You've got to be kidding me. There's absolutely no way you can tell whether or not he heel strikes based on that photo. You and Ayedubbs both think you're experts on judging people's form based on profile pictures, but (1) you don't know what's about to happen in the split second after the frame, and (2) you don't know what happened in the split second before the frame.
I would say to really focus on driving your knees to increase your turnover. If you focus on your knee drive then the legs seem to follow suit. Also, cross training by cycling really ups my turnover since I'm really working my quads over my entire legs, I'm sure the same would be applicable with some similar lifting (I don't really lift too much, so I'm not 100 percent sure on that.. squats, maybe?) I run the 800, and it seems to help my turnover quite a bit, hope it helps!
Nice video, and discussion. Agree that the 180 cadence is important. I also like strides to improve form. Did i just read that profile pictures cause over striding?
It's not the one I really think hits the discussion, but yea, it brings up some decent points. I can't find the 'most relevant' one - the guy presenting the info is also the model.
It's not the one I really think hits the discussion, but yea, it brings up some decent points. I can't find the 'most relevant' one - the guy presenting the info is also the model.
One thing I'm not so sure I agree with is when he says your stride should be longer on down hills. The biggest mistake people make when running down hill is they lean back. Never lean back. Lean into the hill. Be perpendicular with the hill. I hear so often how tough Boston is. Bulls**t. Boston isn't tough, it's just that people run the down hill (and don't train for them) wrong. St. George is another example of a very fast race if you run it right. Lean into a down hill, not backwards. Natural reaction is to lean back. Lean into it. If you feel like you are out of control because of leaning into a down hill, then shorten up your arm swing and bring your arms close to your body.
One thing I'm not so sure I agree with is when he says your stride should be longer on down hills. The biggest mistake people make when running down hill is they lean back. Never lean back. Lean into the hill. Be perpendicular with the hill. I hear so often how tough Boston is. Bulls**t. Boston isn't tough, it's just that people run the down hill (and don't train for them) wrong. St. George is another example of a very fast race if you run it right. Lean into a down hill, not backwards. Natural reaction is to lean back. Lean into it. If you feel like you are out of control because of leaning into a down hill, then shorten up your arm swing and bring your arms close to your body.
I agree. The one thing that always gets me - especially with the longer distances - is when I get to watch people fly downhill, looking like a college frat boy witnessing his first kegger or a frat boy at one of the 'Warrior Dashes'. Guaranteed, the moron will be passed during the following uphill portion as he is sucking on air and stuttering around, looking like a frat boy the day after his first kegger.
A faster turn-over is important for a several reasons.
You reduce the air phase of your gait cycle.
You're less likely to over-stride.
The strength needed to push you up and forward is lessened because now you don't have to push yourself as high and as far; this means more Type 1 fiber usage and less Type 2 induced adaptations.
The impact forces on the ground change significantly: the breaking force is reduced when you start to land your feet closer to/behind your center of mass, and the vertical impact force you suffer when you touch the ground.
About running down hill, the science remains the same as running up hill or flat. The turn over rate should always be 180 steps per second. Only thing that changes is your stride length:
a. When running up, your stride will shorten to reduce stress/strain
b. When running down hill, your stride will lengthen as this is the only way to maintain your body on the "constant falling" mechanically advantageous situation.
If you're at any other angle than perpendicular to the road when going down-hill and you're braking yourself using your stride, congratulations, you're now putting 180 cycles of heavy load shear stress on your knees and they will not last long. This is Biomechanics 101.
One thing I'm not so sure I agree with is when he says your stride should be longer on down hills. The biggest mistake people make when running down hill is they lean back. Never lean back. Lean into the hill. Be perpendicular with the hill. I hear so often how tough Boston is. Bulls**t. Boston isn't tough, it's just that people run the down hill (and don't train for them) wrong. St. George is another example of a very fast race if you run it right. Lean into a down hill, not backwards. Natural reaction is to lean back. Lean into it. If you feel like you are out of control because of leaning into a down hill, then shorten up your arm swing and bring your arms close to your body.
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